tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post4226057840052366196..comments2024-03-27T06:56:10.255+00:00Comments on Broad Oak Magazine: "Elitist" education and Britain's survivalUnknownnoreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-54021078495220775022017-09-10T17:44:48.908+01:002017-09-10T17:44:48.908+01:00As here in the US, the growth in the economy has, ...As here in the US, the growth in the economy has, for 200 years, been the achievement of the second-tier people. That is, those not rich enough for the 'top' education at Eton, Harrow and Oxbridge. Where do most of our Engineers and Scientists get educated?Paddingtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07952088638231881617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-35589026367690948402017-09-10T15:54:05.889+01:002017-09-10T15:54:05.889+01:00Hi Paul, good to hear from you. Actually it was/is...Hi Paul, good to hear from you. Actually it was/is a three-tiered system, with Eton, Fettes etc training the elite. I'm working my way through a book by Correlli Barnett where he makes the point that public school education (classics etc) was about preparation for rule, not leading the economy. Maybe they do less Latin at public schools these days but I see little sign among our politicians of understanding economics and how to make things work. They'll do PPE at Oxford, then get a job as a spad and off you go, like Cameron. Industry is full of the "little men" who are expected to service these types. Politics, law, finance - nothing involving Swarfega.<br /><br />He would like to have seen more "grammar techs" to train production engineers, the ones who turn brilliant discoveries into manufactured, marketable products.<br /><br />Mixing all levels of talent in one class means a tendency towards the average, especially since the State makes a fuss about bringing up the bottom end. There was some move to help the G&T (gifted and talented) but in most schools, no traction.<br /><br />The school I talked about was exceptional and was really a grammar, secondary modern and special school under one roof, with bullying kept down by a very domineering staff approach. Other schools didn't manage it and I'm sure a lot of talent rotted. <br /><br />The days of secondary mods staffed by ex-servicemen are gone; there is the framework for a good basic education for all. We need to nurture the talent if we're not going to have a country of second-raters employed by foreign billionaires. Funny how excellence is allowed in sport and entertainment, but not in helping the country learn how to earn a living.Sackersonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17284329249862764601noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-52848037727557939462017-09-10T15:33:54.970+01:002017-09-10T15:33:54.970+01:00I failed the 11+ in 1961 and spent most of my high...I failed the 11+ in 1961 and spent most of my high school education at secondary modern schools. The word "secondary" highlights the stigma felt by the teachers and the pupils as failures. 400 kids packed into a school built for 250, only the headmaster had a degree or teaching qualifications, only 1 student in 75 years had ever progressed to university. There was no provision for classes beyond 15 years old. Grade 10. Losers.<br />I somehow got transferred to Buxton College, a grammar school, not far up the road but a world apart. All the teachers had degrees except the games master, and several PhDs. Resources abounded. Yes, of course the students excelled academically and the assembly hall had rolls of honour on wooden plaques for the hundreds going to university. Only Oxford and Cambridge you understand. <br />Yes, concentrating educational resources will establish an elite who are important to lead a country in innovation. But there aren't too many labouring jobs anymore. Actually the whole population has to be educated up to their potential and tolerance level (learning is really hard work). Countries like Singapore invested in education a long while ago and it has paid off enormously. Sure, boost the gifted, but don't have a two tier system and the corrosive stigma for the losers.Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13177995533966453125noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-4598853883314588092017-09-09T23:35:56.265+01:002017-09-09T23:35:56.265+01:00I too went to a total of 3 secondary schools (Brit...I too went to a total of 3 secondary schools (British Army kid), 2 of them grammar schools. The students were really better, and bullying much less.<br /><br />I went on to Exeter University in 1975, where I received a first-class education that more than prepared me for more graduate work in the US.<br /><br />The selective system was cruel in some ways, but it worked.Paddingtonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07952088638231881617noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-10612616921845981572017-09-09T21:15:50.760+01:002017-09-09T21:15:50.760+01:00I was a grammar school gal, and have been everlast...I was a grammar school gal, and have been everlastingly grateful for it. I'm probably older than most of your readers. I passed what used to be called the 11+ exam in 1950. This gave me a "scholarship" to one of several local grammar schools, within daily travelling distance of home. The school I and my parents chose was one which, had been, not that long ago, an elite boarding school, closed to all but kids of wealthy parents. It retained an air of restrained elegance...until we, the great unwashed but bright ones arrived that is! ;-) It was an all-girls establishment; the boys had their own choices of grammar schools.<br /><br />After 5 years I took 7 (academic) 'O'Levels passed them all and begged my parents to allow me to hit the road. I wanted to see more than classrooms, meet more than students and teachers, and get away from our boring small market town. Did that, and found my modest, but not too common out in the wild, qualifications got me everywhere I wanted or needed to go. I ended up, eventually, the civil service in a legal department.<br /><br />These days, in the USA, where I've lived since 2004, there's so much emphasis on hallowed "college education", yet from what I can see, many of those with that vaunted level of learning are no better educated than I was/am (excluding, of course, dedicated specialists : medical, law etc.) In fact, when I completed some on-line quiz recently - quite a long one, purporting to tell me my education level (USA style), I came up with a Bachelor's degree. LOL!<br /><br />So yes, bringing back grammar schools would be A Good Thing. Twilighthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14138621610593773784noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5524682876220396502.post-91079908264347467642017-09-09T20:05:07.406+01:002017-09-09T20:05:07.406+01:00I agree, we do need those grammar school children....I agree, we do need those grammar school children. We also need the political nous to understand why and that seems to be as far away as ever.A K Haarthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05897490979828603179noreply@blogger.com